Megan Riksen:

Hello and welcome to the Work Like a Laker podcast. I'm Megan Riksen, and today I am joined by Dani Lauer. Hi Dani.

Dani Lauer:

Hi Megan.

Megan Riksen:

And today we are talking through job rejection and what to do about that. Yeah.

Dani Lauer:

It's a heavy topic.

Megan Riksen:

It's, yeah, it's, it's not the most fun topic in the world, but we really, we wanna work on some strategies and we definitely, we have five tips on how to persist through your job search despite your setbacks. And this is an episode that's great for anyone. We really had alumni in mind when we were writing it, but the more we look at the content, the more we realize this is when you're applying to internships, this is when you are applying as a senior, getting ready to graduate, and it applies across the board.

Dani Lauer:

So true. And I think we've all maybe experienced some form of job rejection Yes. In our paths. So I think pretty much everyone can relate.

Megan Riksen:

Yes. Job rejection or just rejection in general. The feelings are kind of similar. Right.

Dani Lauer:

Yeah. And we'll, to, we'll get into talking about that, because they are kind of similar. Yes.

Megan Riksen:

Yes. All right. So tell us what, what we're talking about when we are describing job rejection.

Dani Lauer:

Yeah. So for the purpose of today's episode, we're gonna use that term in the context of applying for jobs and just not being selected for the position. Right. So, I mean, this can be indirect in the sense that you never hear back from positions that you applied for or that kind of direct rejection in the sense. That you went through an interview process, you talked to people, you were invested only to find out that you weren't the candidate selected Yeah. For the job. So even though, I mean, they're somewhat different experiences, really, we found that similar feelings can be associated regardless. So that's -

Megan Riksen:

Totally true.

Dani Lauer:

Yeah. So, I mean, I think the first place to start is kind of why does job rejection even happen in the first place? And there's really a many reasons. There's definitely not just one kind of reason that this, this is a phenomenon even in some ways. So I think, first of all, I think it's helpful to keep in mind that it's not always personal. I think especially when this is happening to you and it's your unique experience, it feels like you as a person are being rejected.

Megan Riksen:

Yes. And you've poured yourself into this application and resume and maybe interview you. You really, you have to lay it on the line so much Right. When you're applying to a job.

Dani Lauer:

Right? Yeah. So when you're getting that no, or even that, yes, I'm just being ghosted by an employer. Right. Like, we take that personally. Totally. And that just isn't always the case. Right. So it's actually a really helpful strategy for navigating this and the process in general is to know like, this isn't personal always. We also know that the world of work has changed quite a bit. And I would say especially since COVID, this has led to, you know, fluctuating job market dynamics, entry level job challenges, even an evolution of the job search process altogether.

Megan Riksen:

Yeah, that's true. It's so different depending on industry or what type of role you're applying for, things like that. So it's not like there's one thing across the board that Yep. You know, you can pretty much expect this is gonna happen throughout the process. So that just makes it even more of a difficult kind of landscape to navigate.

Dani Lauer:

Yeah. It feels more complicated. It does. It's, yeah, it can be really tough. So, I mean, other reasons include, you know, maybe skill gaps or even a cultural fit. Right. So remembering that all employers handle their hiring practices differently. You know, there's usually not one specific reason why you aren't feeling successful in the process. You can't just boil it down to, well, it was definitely this, it's probably a combination of all -

Megan Riksen:

Yeah. And it might be a different combination for where you're applying. Or what you're applying to. Right. Like in some cases it could be, ah, you didn't align your resume well enough, and another case could be like, oh, you didn't sell yourself in the interview, or, you know, you didn't network. Ah, yeah. It's complicated.

Dani Lauer:

Yeah, definitely.

Megan Riksen:

All right. So if this is something that you have been experiencing the first thing we want you to know is that it's just so normal to feel frustrated. This is a frustrating process. You're gonna feel disappointed. And that probably is gonna lead to, you know, those good old feelings of self-doubt and insecurity. Which are super fun.

Dani Lauer:

So fun. We love that. Not.

Megan Riksen:

Exactly. Yeah. The job search process can take a real emotional toll and handling rejection on a regular basis. It's exhausting. Totally. You know, it, it, yeah. It takes its toll for sure. I remember when I graduated from my undergrad, I was pretty lost in what I wanted to do, so I just ended up applying to a million things Yeah. In different industries and different roles. And I had no, like true north of what I was going for, and therefore I experienced a ton of rejection. Yeah. And probably mostly ghosting, right? Like it mostly was not hearing back. Yeah. so it, yeah. It happens to everybody.

Dani Lauer:

I was gonna say, I feel like I hear that. It's so common, right? To just kind of throw your name in the ring for all these different types of positions. And then, yeah, you just don't know what's gonna happen there.

Megan Riksen:

No, exactly. So yeah, it's good to maybe think back to another time where you were rejected. Maybe it was being cut from a sports team or going through a serious breakup. Like oof, those are feelings and Yeah. Can you like think back, like what were you experiencing? What were those feelings like? Especially when it's like fresh, right? When it is acute, these really intense feeling, something just happened. And more than likely it was a painful and unpleasant experience in your life, straight up. So then imagine that feeling being multiplied over many weeks and even months on end.

Dani Lauer:

Awful. Terrible

Megan Riksen:

Breaking up with someone over and over and over. Like that's, that's not good. That's gonna make anybody feel pretty weary and defeated. And yeah, I think we would argue that job rejection really is a quite similar feeling. So also just like we didn't necessarily know how to handle a breakup or getting cut from a team, especially if it's like your first time that that's happening to you. We also might not know how to handle or process job rejection. But that's what we're here for today. Yeah. So you wanna kick us off with some tips? I

Dani Lauer:

I would love to. Yeah. And that, I mean, that is such an intense feeling, especially to feel over several weeks or months or however long you're in that process. And I think, you know, that's kind of where our first tip kind of lands is figuring out and identifying, you know, what are those emotions being brought to the surface and taking time to actually process how you're feeling. Right. I think when negative emotions arise, a lot of times we just hope those feelings go away. Try to avoid them because -

Megan Riksen:

Ignore it.

Dani Lauer:

Yeah. Just stuff it down, keep on moving, stay positive, which yes, we do wanna stay positive, but a lot of times those feelings don't just leave.

Megan Riksen:

No

Dani Lauer:

No

Megan Riksen:

They don't. Maybe when you finally get that job, then they leave. But not until that point.

Dani Lauer:

Yeah. Being able to acknowledge them and name them. Even I think in this case, you know, talking to a trusted friend, a therapist, even a career coach, just having some kind of outlet for what you're going through and to have some support around your job search. You know, the job search process is a really, it's like having a second job, right? If you're working full-time and you're also trying to apply for other jobs. And so having some support and I think too, right, kind of to our point before it can feel really isolating to go through this process by yourself to not know anyone else experiencing what you're experiencing. And that really messes with motivation and confidence, which is like what you need to persist through the job search process. And continually putting yourself out there.

Megan Riksen:

Exactly. What's, what's your coping strategy? Who would you talk to if you were going through this?

Dani Lauer:

Oh man. Definitely have some trusted friends. Be like, yeah, you know, let's go out for coffee. Yep. And Yep. Can I just buy you a coffee and tell you how things are going?

Megan Riksen:

All my struggles? Yeah.

Dani Lauer:

Yeah, I mean, my therapist is pretty great as well. And yeah, just somebody who's gonna be able to hold that space and not be judgy.

Megan Riksen:

And maybe provide a little perspective.

Dani Lauer:

Right. Right.

Megan Riksen:

Because we can get really stuck. Like, I'm never gonna find a job. Like, you can go down into a really fun little rabbit hole. Oh yeah. Little deep dark space. And yeah, just finding those people who can pull you out of that.

Dani Lauer:

Oh, for sure. Who are your people, Megan?.

Megan Riksen:

Yeah, I would say same thing. I mean even my mom like, she's a great kind of sounding board for me throughout my life. Even now that I'm much beyond undergrad. But yeah, I think having, yeah. A couple of friends and then family for sure.

Dani Lauer:

Yeah. I mean, I think just to know that you're not in it alone Yeah. Even if you're the only person you know that's going through this Yeah. Just to have people around you supporting you, help you move through some of those negative emotions. So helpful.

Megan Riksen:

Exactly. Awesome. All right. So our second tip is to seek feedback from recruiters and people kind of in this process, the human resources professionals, and use their feedback as a tool for growth. So, you know, not every recruiter provides feedback to candidates. Like that's, that's just something that they're not able to do or don't have time for, whatever it may be. But some do and can provide you really with invaluable information that you can then use to help to improve yourself in whatever kind of way you might need to. And you might even use this feedback to reflect on your goals and your job search strategy in general. So, you know, that can be as simple as, you know, you get kind of the canned email back from the ATS system. But you look up a recruiter who works at that company or you go to a career fair and figure out, you know, who's the recruiter for Grand Valley at that company. And you just start to seek some feedback. If you've gotten to an interview stage, I would say definitely ask for feedback because that means you've made it further along in the process and you've already then had actual conversations with people. So reach back out to those people and yeah. Just ask for kind of that really honest feedback. Yeah. And hopefully they provide it for you.

Dani Lauer:

Yeah. I've actually done this before when I didn't get a job that I interviewed for. And it was kind of going back to that it's not always personal.

Megan Riksen:

Right.

Dani Lauer:

I, you know, I was really disappointed that I didn't get the position. I was really excited about it. I thought the interview went really well.

Megan Riksen:

That's especially hard. It's when you're like, this was a great interview and you're riding high. Right?

Dani Lauer:

Like, where did I go wrong? What could I do better for next time? And the interviewer, you know, basically affirmed me and said, I did do a great job interviewing. It was simply the amount of experience the other candidate had. You know, just, it was just this intangible thing. Right. So that would be a skills gap that Totally, I didn't have the supervisory experience that the other person did at the time and that was the main reason. Yeah. So that gave you some peace of mind.

Megan Riksen:

Yeah.You don't feel bad about yourself anymore. You instead maybe have something a little bit actionable like, okay, maybe I do need to stay in the role I'm in now and look for supervisor experience as your example or whatever it may be.

Dani Lauer:

Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. Yeah. And so our third tip kind of ties into that second tip as well, which is to identify those gaps or skills, you know, that you might be lacking. Right. So depending on what kind of feedback you get, like you might notice that you might need to find some ways to fill in those gaps. And that can look like a lot of different things. Right? Soft skills, hard skills, things that are specific to a position that you're applying for. You know, to obtain those skills and to gain those experiences before your next job interview, you might look in a lot of different places. Right. That might look like a free online certificate. That you get through, you know, LinkedIn potentially. Or something like that. GVSU offers certificates and badges. Right. So you might wanna look at some of the different credentials you could add. Some of those are vast, you know, like a 10 week long certification. And that might be what you need to kind of take it to the next level. Maybe working with a career coach, networking events to kind of work on some of those soft skills if you find that that's, you know, the thing that you need to grow in the most. And we'll link some of these resources down in the show notes.

Megan Riksen:

Yes, we can definitely do that.

Dani Lauer:

Yeah. So I mean, you just, I think getting that feedback, knowing what you might wanna grow in. Super helpful

Megan Riksen:

For sure. Great. Okay. Our fourth tip is centered on tailoring your cover letter and resume to each job application. So probably the best way to do this is really review the job description. Yeah. What are you applying for, right. What are all those elements? What are the skills, what are the experiences, what are the elements of that role? And then really trying to reflect that as much on your resume as possible. So I, I literally like to go line by line of a job description, like how is this little piece incorporated into my resume? Yeah. Right. Yeah. because it, it, I think it forces you to think back through all of your past experiences and be like, oh, I totally forgot I did that, but that relates, I'm gonna make sure I add that and don't discount the cover letter either. 'cause Of course the resume is kind of the grand list of all the things you want them to know, but the cover letter is your chance to tell a little bit more of a story. Right. And to maybe highlight one of those amazing experiences that you have. So especially if you are going through your job search process and you're not getting interviews yet, this is where you should begin. Because either that resume isn't getting through the ATS system or it is just not connecting with the people who are reading it. So definitely start there and of course we're the career center. We have tons of resources for you.

Dani Lauer:

We sure do! Yeah. Yeah. And then our fifth and final tip is really prioritizing self-care and you know, that might sound kind of obvious to some people, maybe not. I mean I think it's really helpful to take time to, you know, self-reflect. Practice gratitude. I think especially in a season where you might be feeling more discouraged than every day. Than those gratitude practices can be super helpful. And even ways, you know, engaging activities that help you build confidence, this is a process that might make you feel that insecurity or kind of knock that confidence down a step. So if you can incorporate some things where you're feeling like a good confidence boost or just injecting positivity into your life wherever you can. So helpful to stay -

Megan Riksen:

How are you like, switching up your routine? Back, back, as I was mentioning when I was applying right out of undergrad, I would just get stuck in such a cycle of just online application after online application. And that you have to switch it up. What else can you be doing? And we can definitely help in the career center with that as well and have tons of resources of, you know, what's lacking in this process. Maybe you need to stop just applying and you need to shift to networking for a while. And actually be talking to people, which that's gonna be a whole different level of energizing you. That's a practice of care in and of itself to not be stuck in front of your laptop. For eight hours a day. But instead saying No for half of those, I'm gonna reach out to people and I'm gonna do coffee and or Zoom or whatever it may be. That I think can also kind of fall under that category of like awareness of yourself and taking care of it.

Dani Lauer:

Right. And you just never know who you're gonna meet in those networking conversations or professionals groups or alumni events or whatever you might go to.

Megan Riksen:

There's so much out there.

Dani Lauer:

Right. And you just don't know what those connections are that people are gonna have. And it, it could lead to something really great.

Megan Riksen:

Totally. Yeah. Awesome. Good. Alright, well those were our tips today. We hope this episode is helpful for those of you in the throes of job searching because we know this process can be overwhelming and we hope that you can use a few of these tips to build some resilience and strength so that you can keep on going. So definitely make sure you visit the show notes. We will link a bunch of great resources and thank you so much to everyone for listening, and we hope you tune in to a future episode soon.